As of the recent scientific trending and all that nonsense, BPA or Bisphenol-A is getting alot of media attenion still being used in plastic bottles in the US. Canada is banning the chemical in the use of BPA in any child product, and as of the last week or two, the State of California is banning the use of BPA in baby bottles. My question, when you shop for these things, do you look for products without BPA? Give any credit to the studies done? If you're in the dark as to what i'm talking about, check this out. www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=751124 Either the previous or moreso this. www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/science/jan-june08/bottle_05-20.html The Journal-Sentinel broke the story on this stuff in the US awhile back and is making good headway with the subject. As far as were concerned, Medela all the way. Either that or Dr. Brown's GLASS bottles. What's your take?<br><br>Bri-

DadLabs discussed this at length (prior to the cribs forum)... I'm all for the glass bottles. And I called the Mr.Obvious in the previous discussion... isn't it a lawsuit waiting to happen if companies keep using this stuff? What did I see on the news this morning? I know it was obvious, but I'm still claiming the prophecy. <br><br>I was shocked when I first heard about this. Because our sample bottles of formula were #4 plastic, one of the BPA laden versions... and we got those from the hospital, who got them from the Similac! That's just stupid.<br><br>BUT, after my wife read through much of one of the studies, I'm less paranoid about general exposure. They really put the bottles through some damaging tests to get exposure... much harsher than normal use... And from what I have read, none of the studies show any direct problems, particularly with normal exposure. I'm not saying people are being alarmist, but I think it's not something to freak out over. Don't heat the plastic, and certainly don't feed the kid plastic...<br><br>I'm not heating food up in/on plastic even for myself, let alone a plastic bottle. We've gone completely to glass, but mostly because they're easier to clean. (Indy's first chore will be DISHES!) Just suckin' on a plastic sippy cup, I think children will be just fine.

I'm kind of middle of the road on this one. I've look at the studies and agree that there is probably something to be a bit concerned about. We have bought new water bottles for the family, as we had amassed about 15 of the good ole' Nalgene bottles that have BPA. Not necessarily out of alarm, but because I don't want to mess with my health any further. (I have chronic kidney disease, which is completely NOT related, but it brings about extra caution)<br><br>The bottles that we bought for our daughter are in the BPA camp. She is about the right age to begin weening herself, so we decided to stick with them rather than fork out $10 per bottle to replace them. We decided this in part because of cost, but also because of the testing methods that Nik refered to. We certainly don't boil our bottles for ten hours and give them to the baby.....<br><br>FYI - the cheapest bottles out there ($3 for 3) are also BPA free! They're pastel in color, and I believe that they're playtex. They are SOFT plastic, which is safe. We did buy a set of those (just three as a trial) and use them in the rotation.<br><br>I think that BPA will disappear from the market quietly and we won't have to worry about it when we buy new toys.

We are all about BPA free products. We're going to be BPA free all the way for our little peanut. My wife will be using a Medela pump and the bottles that come with it are, of course, BPA free. When the baby is about 2 1/2 to 3 months, we will introduce him to bottles (he'll be exclusively breastfed beforehand). Anyone other than my wife will be able to give him a bottle (to reduce nipple confusion). Anyway, she's hooked on the Adiri Natural Nurser. It's a BPA free bottle that you fill from the bottom, and it's shaped more like the breast than any other bottle on the market. She talks about these bottles so much, that's how I know so much about them. She found a study that showed that 90% of breastfed babies who were given this bottle took it right off the bat, another reason she wants our little guy to use these. But, when mom's around, it'll be breast.<br><br>I'm a pharmacist at a hospital, so I have a lot of associates who are doctors. They always help me find the latest medical journals on certain things (whatever my wife is investigating for the week), and I can assure that the information we've found on BPA ... by ourselves and in medical journals, is frightening. Thank goodness someone caught on to this chemical. The way that plastic bottles are made now is totally different than how they were made years ago, which is why BPA is of concern now and wasn't then. Plastic bottles today are made as cheap as they can be made, with the worst possible chemicals. My wife and I have even stopped purchasing bottled water and soda. The new home we're having built has a built in water filter so that we can have water minus the BPA and other harsh chemicals.<br><br>Now we don't take it to the extreme. My wife has actually read blogs from mother's who won't use high chairs, bibs, combs ... items that you won't allow to get warm enough to leach chemicals, with BPA in them. For us, we want our so to grow up without being exposed to the harsh chemicals of the world. Yes, we grew up on whatever and whichever, but we now have the opportunity to do better for our child, and we will. For us, BPA free is the way to be.

I'm not really alarmed. I saw an interview with one of the scientific and he just said There is not really a proof that this has affected someone, but why take the risk?... umm, really? NO PROOF AT ALL? weird... I thought that you should only talk about a scientific fact if there is proof. Does it REALLY affect someone or you are just one of the scientific that opened that new BPA FREE bottles company...<br><br>How sure are you that BPA bottles are really BPA free?<br><br>Is BPA worse than glass... how sure are you that your glass bottle is free of mini glass particles that can actually STAB your baby's tummy?... cause kids play with them bottles all the time, they break! even when you wash them...<br><br>I don't know... we all where nursed with BPA bottles and we are fine... but that's just me. When I know about someone that actually start having problems because of BPA, then Ill be alarmed.

Taking a look back at just where BPA came from, it's not surprising as to the effects of the chemical at extremely low level doses. BPA was the second try at a synthetic estrogen back in the late 1930's. Originally the plan was for a chemical to aid infertility, known as DES. The chemical worked but had terrbile side effects, such as female toddlers being diagnosed with uterine and other cancers that only attack the female reproductive system. The checmical was declared a failure and another solution had to be found. The second shot at this type of drug was known as BPA. The drug in it's best form worked but it had to be injected. So after all that research and time involved to now know that they had two drugs that did nothing borderline extreme harm to the endocrine system, they had to do something with either one. DES was abandoned, and afer experiments were done with BPA, they mixed it with two types of resins and hence BPA in it's form as we know it today was invented. As a synthetic estrogen, it worked for crap, due to side effects. As a protective plastic however is works great when used proper for the application.<br><br>NOW here's the kicker. In all testing done in animals, regardless of who paid for it, one result is the same. Fetus alond with extreme young CANNOT metabolize BPA. How do we know? BPA is in the urine of the adult, but not in the urine of the fetus or the extremely young. Coincidently over 95 percent of American ADULTS have BPA in their urine. No studies have been done count PPM in infant urine. If they did however, i'd be willing to bet a fair amount of my paycheck thet you don't find any. Why? EVEN IN UTERO, a fetus cannot metabolize BPA and it will be stored in their body, until their liver is mature enough to flush it from their system, which won't be for some time, even neonatal. Hence, none in their urine since their storing it unwillingly.<br><br>This brings me to the whole hormone thing. As any MD will tell you, hormones are low level signals, used by the body for just about anything. If you have a high level signal, the body will generally ignore it but low level is how the dance is done. Considering BPA was designed to be a syntheic estrogen, and was tested at doses WELL BELOW what's required to flag a hormone signal, are the results really all that surprising that nothing happens? Not really in my eyes. BPA can be passed to the fetus in utero and even if they haven't left the womb yet, their getting it from the mother, be it mouse or human. Is the problem really with acute exposures to crappy baby bottles or is the problem low levels of enough cumlative in mom built up over a matter of time to make something happen? No long term studies have been done, or not enough to trend data. Why is this a danger? Teflon is in over 95 percent of our bodies but not enonugh us care to have it removed from industry, so they keep using it. Now if some of the BEST scientists in the world, I mean the BEST we have to offer say that at even extremely low doses are harmful, that's good enough for me. Shame on the American chemical industry for not taking action or phasing it out. After all, even DDT seemed like a good idea at the time. Your baby=your choice. My baby=my choice. My choice is BPA free. I stand at about the same point as Teddy M here. We're not extreme with this, but we cook and eat out of Pyrex only. To contrast this with something familiar, I see BPA in products allowed to be used even with the risk is the exact same as smoking a cigarette with a filter. You know what time will do, but we do it anyway. Also, shame on Dr. Brown's for selling bottles TO THIS VERY MINUTE with BPA in them and then HAVING THE BALLS to attempt to sell me two glass bottles for 25 bucks. Hell i'll wheel some out of a piece of friggin wheat of I have to.<br><br>I see BPA like this. If we can avoid it, we will, at any and all costs. Dammit now im all worked up and have to go grill something. As long as there is no BPA in the lining of a bottle of Heineken, i'm sane for now.<br><br>Bri-

This is a really good summary of what many of use have been preaching about. I was horrified to find out about BPA after my son was over a year old & was already using a sippy cup. This means he drank out of the BPA-laden Avent bottles for an entire year. I am still disgusted. I never would have used them had I known.<br><br>I sent a nasty-gram to Avent asking why they have not yet changed their bottles & pacifiers, etc. & of course it has gone un-answered.<br><br>When people say things like, well we were raised with it & we're fine..., I like to point out the massive increase in cancer diagnosis for those of us in our 30's-50's. That points a really big finger at something being wrong during the times we were growing up. Who knows how many different toxins we injested? Our parents didn't know any better either & the results are more people getting sick and dying.<br><br>Sorry, I'll get off of my soapbox now.

I will admit I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to this topic. I really only know what has been posted and stated previously. So with that I will say that I'm not really worried. If it is something of major concern, I think the industries that use this chemical will eventually take it out of their products and life will move on. I'm sure many of you are thinking this guy is an idiot and couldn't agree with me less but that why these forums are interesting. Different people, different choices.<br>I believe, In an effort to make our quality of life better and products greater we will forever run into this problem. We will continue to create man-made chemical and some will be lifesavers and others won't. I think a lot of people get over zealous on topics such as this because we are trying to be healthier and more conscious about what we put in our bodies. But as Nik pointed out after we dig a little deeper and find out what you have to do in order to have these issues arise it seems kind of silly. I always flash to aspartame, when they came out and told us to stop drinking diet soda because it gave us cancer, only to find out that the the quantity you would have to ingest in order to have such an effect was enormous. This might just be the lazy American in me, but I'm all about just living and letting the chips fall where they may. (Which explains why I eat at McD's and could careless about truly eating organic, and the list goes on.)

This whole thing has started to pressure the industry, at least as far as BPA in baby probucts is concerned anyway. Here's a link to a media release from Playtex. They'll send you a free drop-in system for nothing. No joke, no scam, no bull right from Playtex. www.playtexbaby.com/bpafree/Playtex_BPA_Free_Press_Release.pdf It states they will be phasing out the use of all BPA in all of their products. It's good to see the tide finally turning into the direction of the people who matter the most, those who buy and use the stuff everyday. Shame that it takes a WHOLE MESS OF OTHER COUNTRIES banning the stuff before we even think about the bandwagon, or maybe even hopping on. Another wonderful link to an EPA study warning lab techs to remove polycarbonate cages and water bottles from their testing, since it was skewing results and could be released after exposure to heat. The date? 2003. Go figure. www.epa.gov/scipoly/oscpendo/pubs/strain...gt;<br>Science knew about the dangers and cross contaminations for years. The plastics insustry reaped the profits while the comsumers shared the risk. And when your baby is born, they'll do all the tests, take pictures of happy moments, then put them down for their first nap. In a clear plastic tub made of what? That's right. Lexan. Otherwise known as the purest form of BPA there is. When you hit the soda machine, tap on the front. That cool looking plastic face, along with the buttons? Yeppers, you got it. This crap is everywhere and you have no choice but to accept it. Or do you? Do you really have to take the risk? Of course you don't. You're an American, you're free, no one would ever put anyone at risk for the gain of a profit, now would they. Or we could leave it up to Congress to do something about it and protect us all, see what a great job they're doing for gas prices? Point being to this rant is WE have the power to change this, but only if enough people take hold of their

For those of you who are concerned, the FDA just stated that the bottles are still safe to use but, ...acknowledged that more research is needed to fully understand the chemical's effects on humans...

The FDA report really hasn't changed my mind on this issue. This smells like industry pressure to me. This to me sounds like safe until proven otherwise. The bans in Canada and elsewhere speak much more loudly to me. It's possible to avoid this stuff with a little care and attention. Why not do it?

I had a conversation with an inspector from the Minnesota division of the compliance branch for the FDA, sad thing is the studies they are citing are all industry funded. Funny how the results turn from one side of the fence to the other depending on whose paying. The maximum set exposure limits they recommend are interesting if not strange. I'm still wondering how they got ahold of these figures, I suspect a study done in Britain. The main culprits were older baby bottles made in Korea, plus certain cans of vegetables. Formula was in the mix but not at the top of the list. Considering the only reason they issued such a release is to pacify a dying industry, that only gives them more shame in my eyes. There are alternatives to BPA, but noone cares enough to put those initiaves into play. Okay guys, seriousy, if you can find glass anywhere and it is highly recyclable, why not put formula in a powdered form, IN GLASS??? If acids in certain vegetables cause it to leach, why not package them IN GLASS??? If the FDA is playing the game to gain some funding, maybe they could shove their results, up their GLASS??? We are so dependant on tin cans and plastic this and plastic that. Glass has been around for a gooooood, looooong time and no harm done from that. I guess grandma with the Mason canning jars was right.<br><br>If you pour over the results from exposure studies of just how much of this stuff is released, you'll see at least one of two things. One, yes there is a considerable amount of this stuff we are ALL exposed to everyday with no guidelines for exposure. Two, this is not the only chemical causing the problems. Once you intriduce that stuff into the body, who knows what cocktail is floating around. When you take a chemical like this, with a half-life of 4 days, and test the whiz of Americans and find it in 95 percent, i'm afraid to say that baby bottles just might be the least of our worries.<br><br>Bri-

www.eeletter.com/bpareport.pdf<br><br>Just do me a favor and read page 16 of this. THEN decide if you want your little ones to be exposed. Once again, it's NOT all BPA that is the problem. Know how many endocrine/estrogen disruptors in the industry, just as untested as this? 13,000 or better. So the FDA kicks in their bought and paid for .02 Yes, I feel much safer already. Now i'm going to go buy a bag of sand and bury my head in it. After that i'm going to turn on a calculator with no buttons and figure out the speed of dark. Trust me on this, read page 16, the rest if you get ambitious enough.<br><br>Page 16 is citing that .223 parts per billon is enough to cause cancer to get tougher and insulin combined make you a helluva lot heavier. Keep in mind that according to other studies, cited elsewhere in that document, you already have up to 5 ppm in THE WATER YOU DRINK. Not .000005, yep that's right, 5 ppm. 25 times the threshold of what it supposedly takes to screw your cells royal. Happy drinking. How am I drinking it? What do you think the UV coating on paper is made out of? What happens to that coating when the paper gets recycled into say.... a Starbucks cup and gets heated up by the coffee you drink?<br><br>Why do my eyes hurt?-Neo<br>You've never used them before.-Morpheus<br><br>Bri-

Hi Bri,<br>Very interesting topic. I made a group named Health and nutrition, please post your topic and discussion there. dadlabscrib.ning.com/group/healthandnutr...;br><br>Sam

This has kindof become a personal quest of mine just to see how bad this treally is and where the industry stands. I was watching a news story on Youtube last night about how alot of counties are individually banning the sale of this stuff, regardless of FDA finding or Government outlook.<br><br>I called Abbot Labs, Inc. Manufacturers of Similac, Glucerna, Pediasure and a few not so well known others. I asked their customer service the array of questions. I expected to be stalled but got right thorugh and they were ready for my questions.<br><br>Bri: Do you use BPA in your products or do you even know what i'm talking about?<br>Abbot: We use BPA in the manufacture of our powdered formula cans for each brand used, we are aware of it's presence and suspected dangers and are designing new packaging which should be out very soon.<br>Bri: Do you offer your products in packaging currently without BPA for those of us who choose to use your product, just not with BPA onboard?<br>Abbot: We currently offer alternatives to the cans with BPA. Please understand that when you have to change the design of a package for infant formula, it may take some time to be approved by the industry and the FDA. The single powder packets available for all of our powdered product lines more than meet the requirements of being BPA free. We are currently making pricing adjustments to match the contents of single powdered packets versus the cans. All ready-to-feed products in liquid form are BPA free.<br>Bri: Are there and liquid products that are exposed to BPA?<br>Abbot: The Glucerna shakes are being sold in a #7 polycarbonate bottle currently.<br>Bri: Are you working on changing that?<br>Abbot: The issue isn't with the packaging, it's the shake itself whereas the formula contained needs a material such as polycarbonate to prevent breakdown. We are in the middle of chaning both the formula and the packaging to accomodate.<br>Bri: Is Abbot Labs aware of the studies out there and are those studies why Abbot Labs is making changes?<br>Abbot: Not so much pressure from studies but pressure from the end use comsumer demanding change.<br>Bri: Have you gotten many calls like this from anxious parents looking for answers?<br>Abbot: The call volume with questions just like yours has forced us to add another shift of call attendants of about 10-12 people full time, so I would give that a definate yes.<br>Bri: Can a consumer with products containing BPA exchange them for products without?<br>Abbot: Unfortunately Abbot doesn't do that, simple reason is that what's bought is a perishable food product, similar to a personal care item.<br>Bri: Are your competitors, such as Nestle ahead or behind you as far as staying on top of this?<br>Abbot: We've heard they are making some similar changes but I can't say anything for them in regards to business practices.<br>Bri: Sounds fair. Is the BPA in cans on the can itself or the ends on the tin?<br>Abbot: There's a large misconception here, it's only ever been on the ends of the cans since we switched over to the cardboard format.<br>Bri: It sounds to me from an educated consumer standpoint that you guys are on top of the ball and forecasting the need for change before it's really required, being dynamic. Hence that's what keeps you guys in good business.<br>Abbot: Abbot saw this coming for a couple of years now, and have been making changes ever since. The new packaging should be out by the end of the year at the latest.<br>Bri:Excellent work and thank you for your time.<br>Abbot: Anytime and your welcome.<br><br>End of call.<br><br>They surprised me by knowing far in advance what was going to happen. They were kind, courteous and to the point. From that phone call, they've got it together and know what the consumer is going after. Tomorrow im going to call Nestle Nutrition and give them the same array of questions. Take care for now, watch Springer or something....<br><br>Bri-

I am just so in awe of your dedication to this. Thank you so much for doing this research for the rest of us. I guess I just wish we all knew about this years ago. My son is now 20 months old & I used Avent bottles & Similac formula once I was done bf'ing. It breaks my heart to know he was exposed to all of those chemicals for such a long period of time.<br><br>As a woman, I am truly thrilled to see so many men (especially you Brian) go to these lengths to be an active & educated part of their children's lives. I'm so lucky to have an awesome husband who adores our son. I speak for all the ladies when I say that you guys are just the best!<br><br>They're going to kick me out of the club for this, but...You go Guys!

I appreciate the Kudos...<br><br>Fatherhood had gotten a bad rap from everyone over the years, and in a good portion of cases, rightfully so. This site was the first site I found with real and I mean REAL guys doing things that REAL guys do. The kudos really and rightfully belong in their direction, the four of them plus all of the interns, producers and guys that specialize in grip. Ummmm yeah, ......grip? Seriously, the role of the father needs this right now. It needs to be sorted out and gone through, refined and polished. It's starting to take a turn for the better and I wholeheartedly admit, with not much family on this end and the lack of an owner's manual for her, I had to start somewhere, and i'm sure damn glad I started here. Takes the edge off alot of topics I would be admittingly LOST and I mean LOST on. The only thing i'm not so sure on is wearing a pink shirt....*ahem*.....lol.<br><br>Thanks again, keep em' safe!<br><br>Bri-

Really interesting.

This is really good to know because we are starting to buy baby bottles and other plastic baby crap and the FDA has recently assured us all we're safe - www.bisphenol-a.org/whatsNew/20080820.ht...lt;br>What's a new daddy to do? I'm going to have to read all your posts.<br><br>Synthetic estrogren? What the--???

What's really interesting, i've ran accross that site you have before. Take a look at who owns/runs that site. You may find it surprising. Yeppers, site and test results sponsored by the plastics industry themselves. Pay no attention to the schmucks behind the curtain. The plastics industry has gotten to the point with profits that they could amost be considered an oil company. But at that rate, baby food by the gallon is still a helluva lot more expensive than gasoline, well perhaps not for long.<br><br>Bri-

Gerber/Nestle nutrition, you're the next contestant on the formula's wrong!<br><br>This whole ordeal of sorting out information that hits you from all sides has gotten more and more interesting by the day. The information is out there but it takes a helluva long time to dig up with ye ol' search engine shovel. Okay, I haven't given them a jingle yet, but Nestle/Gerber Nutrition are the next to be hawkeyed under my magnifying glass. According to their website, all of their product accessories, and I stress accessories will be free of BPA by the end of 2008. They make NO mention of formulas powdered or otherwise. Check it out here for their official. www.gerber.com/faq?catid=5225 Gerber/Nestle get a flunk in my book for the time being, until they get ALL of it out or have plans to.<br><br>The page just basically downplays the effects of BPA and is geared towards those who don't even know what it is or haven't done any research on the chemicals at all. About 95 percent from what i've seen so far keeps it nice and short/sweet in order to get a parent to consider BPA open/shut case and the issue resolved by reading their page and that page alone. On the other side of the spectrum, and I guarantee you're going to see more of this, is class-action lawsuits against manufacturers who mis-state/misrepresent their products and/or don't really have much bearing on why they got into the baby business to start with. (I hope it was for the baby, but turns out to be the money.) It doesn't really surprise me that the first examples of class-action suits have come out of California. I'm not ripping California at all, rather they have been the most progressive when it comes to seek and destroy missions related to harmful things. A fine example can be found here.<br>www.lawyersandsettlements.com/articles/1...;br><br>Now it's beginning to get interesting in regards to companies that are passing the buck and knew about it. What's really neat to see is that these companies are going from prevention to damage control modes in the blink of an eye. This whole shovel-tossing project of mine has opened new doors and avenues for resources about issues as a parent I never even dreamed of. Another good example is this. When you buy/get all sorts of new and exciting baby crap, most of it will be made of some previously toxic waste and recycled into a brandy new bouncer or an SUV that takes a reactor to get your kid 6 feet before they lose interest. This in some ways relates to the Uber Consumer posting to reinforce the point. I would highly recommend getting/buying/holding your shower earlier in order to get this stuff out of the package and let it all offgas. What's offgassing? Not something that usually happens during the course of the football game or when he offgasses and then pulls the covers over your head and chuckles. Offgassing is allowing all of the epoxies and resins along with paints and stains to evapotate off all of the leftovers from manufacturing, such as VOC's or Volatile Organic Compounds. Tip: If you have to buy a chemical, but the chemical with the lowest VOC available, it'll be on the back of the package. Putting a fresh little one into a room of good-ol' American crap that's brand new right out of the boxes is a shoebox recipe for problems/sensitivities now and down the road, possibly even allergies. Examples of offgassing smell? New car smell, new carpet, latex and/or oil based paint, spraying being the worst. If at all possible, stay away from brand new, I mean VERY brand new vinyl products until they've had at least 30 days to offgas. It may even baffle some new parents as to the effects, but think about it, we're used to it. The little ones aren't even used to say..... light?<br><br>Cheers for now!

Who needs Google? We have Bri !<br><br>Thanks. My kids are older but I have a newborn niece whose parents will be getting a phone call very soon.

Today, I finally got tired of hearing Bubba complain about hauling the BPA-free Thermos down to soccer practice. So I went to REI.com and found that the Nalgene and other water bottles they stock are now BPA-free. I know that at his age it's less of a concern, but I was glad to see progress. I bought 2. Bubba will be so relieved.

More hopeful signs. I was in a sporting good store over the weekend buying underwear (another long story for another day), and I happened past by the water bottle shelf. Every single product there boasted loudly of being PBA free. Now it we can just get the stuff out if formula packaging. But Bri is on that one.

Hey guys, i'm not dead, just have a few things to handle at the moment. Her job was cut and now has limited health insurance. I'm on strike up here and it looks to be a knock out drag-out fight. We're getting married and having a child all in the next 72 hours. I'll try to post as I can, thanks for understanding.<br><br>Bri-