“I feel like we should be talking about football.”
“Wait. Give them a shot.”
– CNN hosts, setting up segment on DadBloggers at M3 Summit
Yes, you have to do this. Stop trying to change the fucking subject. You have to talk about being a parent. You have to think about what it means to be a good father. You have to give some consideration to what kind of stroller is best and when to introduce solid foods and whether or not to hold the kid back from kindergarten.
You’d rather talk about football; well, that’s just too fucking bad.
That’s right, I’m talking to you, Drew Griffin, Mr. Snarky CNN Host Guy. I’m talking to you, and to the conventional wisdom that says men don’t want to talk about fatherhood or family or raising kids. According to you, men want to talk about sports and drink beer and look at porn. This is a characterization that I object to even more than the stereotype we see on TV and film all the time: the inept goofball dad or the monster dad. What has me good and pissed is the widespread acceptance of the Don’t Give a Shit Dad paradigm. I’m so sick of that characterization of men that it makes me want to puke — and I like beer and watching sports. Hem.
I think most dads I know recognize that this pose isn’t adequate, even if we indulge from time to time, because it doesn’t serve our wives and our children well, and ultimately it doesn’t serve us well either. What makes dads who we are as men: family, marriage, parenthood.
So I proudly consider myself a dadblogger, though that is something of a sideline for DadLabs. And, as a dadblogger, I get dismissed because guys like Drew Griffin assume that no guys read Dad Blogs.
Problem is, he’s right.
Which doesn’t make him any less of an arrogant bastard.
Dads don’t read dad blogs. There, I said it. Furthermore, maybe it’s not their fault. Maybe dads don’t read blogs because dad blogs suck. After all “Dad Blogs Suck” could well have been the collective title for back-to-back sessions I recently sat in on at the Type-A Mom conference in Asheville, NC. Featuring, Ron Mattocks of “Sugar Milk” and CK Lunchbox, Megan Jordan of Velveteen Mind and Jim Turner of DadStalking, these panels characterized dad bloggers as being clueless, doltish, grasping, uncommunicative, self-loving and commercially driven. I often couldn’t tell if I was at a blog conference or in marriage counseling.
To be fair, the negative behaviors cited above were largely observed in the social media realm, and weren’t a direct criticism of the content or quality of writing found on the average dad blog. And although I myself haven’t experienced the kind of douchebaggery they described (maybe because I’m a perp), I have absolutely no reason to doubt that their characterization is true, nor did I disagree with their assertion that dadbloggers should be more like their more successful female counterparts: community-minded, collective, supportive, and mindful of web etiquette (though there was a whole Norma Rae, We’re-Not-Going-to-Take-Your-Slave-Wages-Anymore-Mr. Internet thing going on at Type-A).
Point taken.
What bums me out was the general consensus that whatever else dadbloggers are doing, we’re certainly not galvanizing men, drawing them online or giving them a basis for conversation. The “Year of the DadBlogger” has failed to materialize. At best the “dad space” is nascent, still ahead of the curve, awaiting the arrival of the legions of dads described by demographers, sociologists and marketing gurus as on the horizon, leading a revolution in the way American families are organized and function.
So what’s it going to take, Dadbloggers, for us to suck less?
At the end of the day, I think there is a ray of hope in what the estimable RebelDad characterized as a hollow mishmash of a cover article in the current Newsweek. I get it that there is a lot of recycled material here — studies on household chores we’ve seen before, Sweden held up as an example, Mad Men examined as a barometer of our times — but there is a call to action that seems essential in order for Dad Blogs to suck less — to change “the prevailing codes of manhood [that] have yet to adjust to the changing demands on men.”
Amen. I’m in. How?
Where do I sign up to change cultural mores? To wag my finger at the likes of Drew Griffin? But without sucking.
Become a Momblogger? Just keep plugging away at what we’re doing and wait for reinforcements? My current thinking is that a little of both will be required.
AMEN Clay!
I don’t know about TypeA , but I know that while I felt good about the interview segment on CNN that we were both part of, the snarky ass comments really pissed me off when watching them.
Glad I’m not the only one that felt that way.
They are just repressed and denying their inner Dad.
This is a GREAT post. I think Dad Bloggers need to stop trying to be Mommy Bloggers first of all. There is a collective chip on the shoulder about brands not recognizing dads, etc. I think this often hurts the content and the conversation. Ultimately Dads have a different perspective. Let’s just be dads, not try to box our experiences into that of moms for the sole purpose of working with brands, etc. I think that will help us all suck less.
Thanks again for the post.
Thanks for the mention, Clay.
I think that one element of the mommyblogging community that goes unnoticed is its sheer diversity of content. Moms are writing about an incredibly wide range of topics; along with the classic “diarist” blogs, there are review sites, how-to sites (covering everything from website design to photography to work-life issues), pop culture and sports blogs written by and for moms, and even political sites. These writers aren’t merely cliched “mommies”. Their community is brimming with intelligent, diverse, and sophisticated women – women who, by the way, happen to be mothers.
So what does this have to do with dadbloggers? I think there’s a kernel of truth in what Mr. Not-Anderson-Cooper is saying. More and more dad blogs are popping up, and our community would be better served if we recognized the value of having something original to say about being a dad. Yes, it’s wonderful, we should all strive to be great fathers, “society” doesn’t “appreciate” dads, we’re so much more involved than our fathers were – we get it. Our community would benefit if more dads were blogging about other stuff that affects us as men, and not merely “dads”. There’s much more to writing about fatherhood – and being a father – than simply talking about how great it is to be a dad. Perhaps the reason that so many dadblogs aren’t attract dad readers is that they are speaking AT dads, and not TO them.
This is such a great synopsis of the challenges facing the dad community. Many dads have shifted their roles, but society is taking too long to shift their expectations. Hence the dissonance that sends dads to blog. And galvanizing more dads to speak out about changing cultural mores is our essential challenge.
Well done, Daddy Clay. And I’m looking forward to you becoming a mom blogger.
For me, the whole change is about not allowing anyone (whether it’s CNN egomaniacs, well meaning journalists, mommy bloggers or even daddy bloggers) define my identity or tell me what being a man means.
All bloggers are self-involved to a point. That’s the definition of a blog, pretty much. But when you talk about yourself or about your family and get one or more person to relate to your story, then you’re doing it right.
Not talking about myself, of course. I’m clueless, doltish, and grasping. But I read well-written blogs written by other fathers. And the sense of community is there.
Well written synopsis and I agree with your take on it, my friend. Oh, did I mention I’m a Dad, even Daddy Blogger, reading this? Shhhh…don’t tell anyone! They might get the idea that we don’t actually suck!
Suck at what exactly anyway? Suck at being Dad’s? Suck at Blogging? Suck at Community? I think it’s the latter that is what’s at question. I think part of that has to do with the fact that many Dads aren’t that Community minded. That’s not necessarily a bad thing. In other words, they like to do their thing and be done with it. I myself am very Community driven. I like people and like talking to both Mom’s and Dad’s.
Dad Blogging is a relatively new phenomenon and maybe the message just hasn’t gone out that if you want there to be a legitimate Community then we all must partake in it and that doesn’t just mean putting up a sign and walking away.
A lot of Dad’s are starting to change their outlook on parenting and their roles. Now that they’re figuring that out they’re starting to blog about it. Now we’re asking them to come to the dance as well. It’s happening but remember…Our brains are little and there’s only so much we can handle at one time. I still have trouble remembering to pick up those socks, you know?
just tried to post a comment and it kicked me out. hope this doesn’t come up twice.
first off, great job, clay.
second, whaddya bet ol drew gobbles up dick pills by the handful? (sorry, SO inappropriate)
i completely agree with the sentiments jason expressed in his comment. i obviously am not the expert that he is, or that y’all are, or that CC and Caleb are, but i can tell you this.
blogs that do nothing more than relay mundane stories germane to the life of the author(s) do NOT attract whether they’re mommy blogs, daddy blogs, martian blogs, etc… don’t get me wrong. of course they’ll be a personal account here and there, but if that’s all there ever is, then sorry, but i’m out.
so what i think our little community needs to do is to follow the lead of y’all and all the other leaders out there and spit out content that doesn’t SUCK. b/c then we’d develop a better readership. then we’d get more comments and engage more. and as soon as enough of that happens, we’d start to become galvanized.
so props to the leaders. now all the rest of us have to do is follow y’all’s lead.
but don’t ever count on the drew griffins to ever change their smug stances and condescending ways. those ships have already sailed. plus, they’re outdated hunks of floating shit (peppered with blue pills) anyway.
great stuff… jco
Well said DaddyClay. Can I still heckle you for the highwaters and white socks?
The guests were great on that piece, the hosts, douches for sure.
Call me a sheep I guess… because while I see the ‘haters’ and the (CNN) jackasses, I don’t see the suckage. It may surprise some here, but in “real life” I’m actually NOT that community oriented. My philosophy is “people suck.” Leave me the hell alone. If I don’t know you, I don’t particularly want to talk to you.
It may just be me, but I think guys are much more selective with our participation/conversations, particularly online. I think guys are ok with ‘lurking’ and checking things out. They don’t feel the need to start their own blog, to talk about all the other blogs they read… which is definitely what MANY (mommy) blogs are.
If you’re talking about football, I’m not going to join the conversation. If you’re talking about skating, I’m all in. If you’re talking about beer, Ben’s got the knowledge to join in for sure. Guys lurk. So I think there may be a “perceived” disconnect to Dad’s(guys) online communities. The diversity is there, car forums, football, sports, fitness… all those communities are out there. But while none of those interest me, and most guys won’t be into ALL of them… the DAD aspects(presented here at DadLabs, and Dad-specific blogs) are something ALL DADS can relate to… So Daddy Bloggers have the potential to actually be reaching a much broader demographic.
I can’t “blame” retailers for ‘Mom-oriented’ packaging. If a Mom on a package sells more of this or that, then it makes sense for them to do that. Seriously. I think there are a few (very few) companies that are FAMILY oriented (BabyBjorn) and don’t put Dad’s on their package to sell specifically to Dad’s… they do it to sell to FAMILIES. That’s bloody brilliant marketing, IMO.
But I personally don’t mind the goofball Dad personifications in movies and sitcoms. Why? Because they’re usually FUNNY! And they’re just MOVIES and SITCOMS!
The “Dad Blogger Revolution” (whatever) has major timing problems. Because of the total chit economy, many Dads (and DadBloggers) are at home, not working. NOT by choice, which is a HUGE difference from most HouseWifeMommyBloggers. So DadBloggin’ still seems to be thought of as something that “unemployed guys” do. And an “unemployed guy” is never going to have as much credibility as a parent as a “housewife mom.” (total bullshit, but that’s how I think pricks like the CNN hosts see it all) DadBlogger is not a “real” job. But somehow, MomBlogger IS? WTF? I think the greatest thing about DadBlogging is that it REQUIRES involvement with your children(otherwise, it ceases being a DAD Blog). And NONE of us are ‘involved’ Dads because it’s “the cool thing” to be, or so we’ll have something to blog about. It’s not even because it’s the RIGHT thing to do… it’s just, quite simply, MORE AWESOME being involved.
But all of this reminds me of a joke I heard a few years ago when the “blogosphere” exploded:
You know the difference between a blogger and that crazy homeless dude standing on the corner talking to himself? Crazy homeless dude doesn’t have a computer.
Have you guys ever noticed that most mommyblogs suck? And all other kinds of blogs? “Suck” as in, are irrelevant to most people other than the blogger, self-serving, poorly written, etc.?
I suspect that on the whole the ratio of sucky/decent blogs is about the same for all categories. I don’t think it’s fair to expect more from dads. It seems like there’s a good selection of really solid dadblogs that have different angles and foci. I don’t get the impression that there’s a dearth of good content. It’s just that dadbloggers haven’t changed the world yet. I’m probably not as frustrated as others in this conversation because I’ve only been reading dadblogs for a couple years, and blogging much less than that.
Regarding what Jason said about all the diversity in mommyblogs: I wonder if a lot of those great blogs are lumped into the “mommy” category just because the bloggers have kids. In other words, good blogs about politics, photography, whatever, written by men who happen to have kids, aren’t categorized as dadblogs and therefore don’t contribute to the overall quality of the genre, whereas the ones written by women do.
I forgot to mention that this was a great post and I love your site! Go community!
beta dad just hit on what I was thinking. There are plenty of blogs written by men who are also fathers, but they aren’t automatically called a “dadblog.” Moms can write about anything, and if they have any children to call their own, then they are a “mommyblogger.”
See? Underwhelming.
Maybe it’s not the year of the dad blog, but I’m enjoying adding more of them to my reader.
Frank Deford said this on NPR Morning Edition the day you ran this blog:
But how can sensitive, modern dads disappear for hours on the links when they have to change diapers, carpool to ballet class and spend their downtime learning how to get in touch with their feminine side?
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=130191271&ft=1&f=4499275
While I am quoting out of context, and while he is trying to be funny, his mindset still comes through. Playing on dad stereotypes, and not working to debunk them.
You had me at “Drew Griffin, Mr. Snarky CNN Host Guy”!
Let’s talk about the elephant in the room – Men are not women. Dads are not Moms. Dads don’t get pregnant, give birth and breast feed. I don’t at all agree with the stereotype of Dads as beer drinking, football watching goons – but let’s also not pretend we are the same as our wives. We are very connected to our kids, but it is different than Moms.
Because Dads are different than Moms, I don’t think we should expect Dad blogs to mimic Mom blogs. I am going to say it, on a whole, Dads are less sensitive, open and willing to talk about certain things than Moms. Of course, exceptions to this rule – but Dad Blogs should not try to be like Mom blogs – because as you correctly state most Dads don’t read blogs.
However – Dads do like to do things, read reviews, connect on products, joke around – all the things that go on here at DadLabs! I don’t think there will be a “Dad Blogger” movement – but I do think there will be a “Dads Joining Together And Doing Things Movement”. I think Dads will connect more on actions than deep feelings.
Clay, you ask if you should wait for reinforcements – the answer is yes! We just launched our DadDoes.Com site with the tag line, “The Place Where Dads Do Things and Review Things”. Sites, maybe more than blogs, that promote how Dads can work together is the future. Dads, I think, can relate to the “I have your back approach” and the future is bright for Dads online, just not in a Mom type of way.
Thanks,
Dan
I’m a single parent; I have my son half of the time, since birth.
Everything I do with my son (who is now 3) is totally up to me. I don’t have any “Mom” (wife) influence at all. No one told me how to give him a bath, how to change his diaper, etc.
I think what I’m looking for in a “dad blog” is some practical information, but mostly the essence of what it means to be a dad — because I don’t do things like “mom.”
Ex:
I took my little one to a parking lot near the airport to watch airplanes take off and land. I looked to my left, and to my right, and there were a half-dozen other Dads (no moms) doing the same thing with their little ones.
It wasn’t a book that told me to go there; it was just a feeling that “this is something the boy needs to see.” And evidently this is one of those things that Dads do with their kids.
This is the stuff that’s uniquely Dad, and IMO is best served by the “dad blog” market — the bits that aren’t Mom; because remember – I don’t give a crap how Mom does it — that’s the “purple house”. This is the “yellow house” where things work Dad’s way.
For Dad Labs, the sort of stuff I’m interested in seeing is:
- Where can I get (or make) a stroller that fits my height?
- How do I do a diaper bag that doesn’t look like a mommy diaper bag? Does Dad even need a diaper bag?? (NO!)
- Where can I get baby clothes that don’t look cutesy?
- (for Portland) What kind of bike trailer, tag-along, bike seat, balance bike, bakfiets, kidztandem, extra cycle, etc should I get? when?
- what are fun things I can do with my son, that would be uniquely dad?
- Tips for hiking with a 3 month old, 1 year old, 2 year old, 3 year old.
- Tips for camping with a 1 year-old, 2 year-old, 3 year-old; especially when it’s just you and them.
- What are things I could do with my son that won’t make me feel like the “not-Mom”? Are there groups / activities / etc out there that are specifically geared towards dads?
Ex: I can’t imagine going to baby sing-a-longs because too many cutesy mommy baby songs would probably just make me want to puke — but swim lessons for a 6 month old – that sounds like fun to me.
- Are there songs for kids that I could sing with my son that aren’t pukey mommy songs?
I find some of the Dad Labs videos to be really inspiring, but some (ex: how to buy your wife a designer diaper bag) totally not. The ones that are most interesting to me are those that have a uniquely non-wife-influenced perspective.
DadBloggers are great and that is my reason of joining this community.Definitely it was not easy to collect and present all this information on this way for the readers.
Great post and topic Clay. I agree that the actual content within the interview was well done, but the segment spiraled completely out of whack once the CNN hosts opened their mouths.
I think we are in the midst of building this community, but at the same time, we have a long way to go. I agree with Jason (DadCentric) about having to speak more TO dads rather than AT them. Hopefully we are doing that. We are trying to position ManoftheHouse.com as a lifestyle magazine for men through the eyes of dad.
Let’s face it … things aren’t always rosy as a parent (mother or father) and those are the types of stories that I know I can relate with. There are struggles I go through everyday just hoping that I’m being a good enough parent and husband, that it isn’t always peaches.
Just my $.02.
Seems that dadbloggers don’t engage in the communal aspect of blogging nearly as much as mombloggers. That is, we’re not doing a very good job of supporting and cross-promoting each other. Even when dads do read others’ blogs, they don’t get involved – they don’t leave comments.
Perhaps it can be argued that blogging should be reward enough unto itself, but it’s tough to keep motivation and momentum without a little validation. Receiving comments are the fastest, surest way to know that your words haven’t fallen on deaf ears. It’s just good “net etiquette,” regardless of whether you’re a momblogger, dadblogger, or whatever. Post comments!
my dadblog sux, but i associate that to me spending more time doing then blogging. that and a true lack of discipline to update it.
having typed that, im not terribly concerned about the opinions of some schmuck from cnn or any other similar media outlet (true or not), or from some high and mighty super mom. produce quality content and it will be read/fwd on. the rest of time needs to be spent raising our children to be the best they can be. i want to be the worlds greatest dad, not the worlds best dad blogger. regardless, this site/blog gets pretty good traffic and you guys should continue to produce and provide the content you have been and what you want, and not pay too much attention to the outside. this isnt an insiders only club, but dont put too much stock in the outsiders.
If your “goal” as a blogger is to get men to read your blog and they don’t, then yes, you suck and your blog sucks. But, if on the other hand, your goal is to blog so you can vent, keep in touch with friends, and just share your crazy life as a Dad then who is to say it sucks? Blogs are like music… not everyone has to like it, in fact, no one needs to. Is it nice to have readers? Yes. But am I going to change what I blog about to pander to readers? No. That is what CNN does. You don’t want to be like them do you?
As far as the snarky comments, suck it up guys. Do I get mad about that? Sure. But I also realize that women and minorities have been stereotyped for a lot longer than Dads. The best way to handle it is to laugh, point out the exceptions, and them proving them wrong through your example.
Have fun,
Al
Good, provocative post.
No, we should not be comparing ourselves to mommy bloggers. It makes no sense. We are in a completely different place. In primary parenting or parenting like an equal, most of us are on new ground. Men come to parenthood with a whole different set of baggage than women.
Yes, we should make our blogs more compelling. to do this, I think we need to talk (and write) honestly about what we feel – the joy (and terror) of being a parent, the self-doubt that comes from not being the primary breadwinner, the pride that comes from knowing we are doing our best to show our kids (and society at large) that there is another way to make families work.
Dad bloggers don’t suck, but we are ahead of the curve. And we shouldn’t be copying mommy bloggers, but we should be following each other closely. We have a lot to learn from moms and there’s a heck of a lot of dads out there who could learn a few things from us.